Crazy stuff

I need a tinfoil hat DP edition. I want it to protect me from reading all tinfoil hat comments on here, once and for all. Make 'em disappear. Do you have one?

 

Sorry, but it would be against our company policy to hold back such timely and critical information from DP-ers.

 

Somebody needs your Humor Model tinfoil hat. I'll never forget when I made a joke about a large grasshopper image that he posted and he went off on me and called me "an idiot". It was at that point that I was forever done with that member.

You can send me that model also as I think I may need it this morning. * memo to myself-stay off of his threads

 

Quoting my father:

Everybody is blaming everyone else and no one is willing to accept responsibility.

Here is my take:

• Parents are responsible for their children’s education. That includes providing them with a moral compass, a thirst for knowledge and respect for their surroundings.
• Teachers are tasked with conveying knowledge. That includes imparting their charges with a desire for further inquiry and the tools to find more.

This has not changed over the ages, what has changed are some of the tools.

Computers and smartphones may have replaced books and libraries – for better or worse. And calculators have taken the drudgery out of arithmetic – that only helps problem solving in mathematics and physics (note the difference between arithmetic and mathematics).

Sadly both parents and teachers fail at their tasks. Parents bribe their children with trinkets to buy themselves “peace and quiet” and teachers train students to pass exams and fail at providing them with tools for the future.

 

It's funny, we were only talking about this today. Takes maths for example all the 'stuff' you HAVE to learn otherwise you can't progress further with your studies, etc., etc., BUT when do you actually use ANY of the stuff you had to learn!. Personally, think grand parents (and parents) have more wisdom they can give their children/ grand children than any school setting ever can.

We as parents need to lead in stead of being led by the school system which hasn't been changed for decades. Too much emphasis is being placed on technology and yet children are not using or encouraged to use their own minds.

When you are young it's OK to draw silly stuff, colour and imagine, when you get older, you are seen as well 'stupid' for lack of a better word, but are you really? If you don't then you are seen as being 'different' but then what is wrong with that?

I think the education system has a lot to answer for because making kids feel they are not good enough, just because of a letter, there is something really wrong about that, so what if you get say a 'D' or whatever and not an 'A' , you may have just had a bad day. Unfortunately, if you are not a 'A' grade student well you never will be ( that is according to the system I guess) it can literally define the rest of your life and where you end up

What kind of message are we giving our kids? How can kids who are so impressionable at that age, possibly feel they have a future when they are being bombarded (on paper) one 'test' and exam after another, they are not good enough?
Had to take off my chest, it was actually something festering inside me today for some reason.

 

Genes play a huge role too. Nobody likes to take an individual blame, but one doesn't have to be a rocket scientist to see how bad genes from mom or dad or both can mess the child up. By bad genes I mean a history of serious mental disorders. Or long term drug or alcohol abuse. To a lesser degree things like narcissism, personality disorders of different kinds (antisocial, borderline, etc.). Although these can be just as bad.

 

I see the railing against tests, grades, etc., above. Let me ask this: when you get seriously ill, do you want your doctor to not have been tested and just waived through to a degree based on fairness, diversity, inclusion, etc.? Or, do you want the aerospace engineer who designed the airplane that you are flying in to not have to had been tested in math or physics so that his feelings would not be hurt? How about the aircraft mechanic maintaining the same airplane? Should he or she be tested to ensure that they understand the workings of the airplane or should we just go with protecting their feelings on this? Or perhaps we can insist that the person's parents teach them aerodynamics? Should the architect that designs the office building you work in actually know math and structural mechanics or can we waive those tests, as well, to preserve their self-image?

How about getting your driver's license? Any need for one of those pesky driving and rules of the road tests that you could fail and have your feelings be hurt? Harvard just said that it is not going to use the SAT or ACT tests as an entrance requirement for some silly social engineering theory. How will that affect the quality and talent of their ensuing graduates?

Should we all just draw silly pictures on paper and feel good about ourselves instead of studying to pass critical skills tests? Note that the control freaks and generally evil people that fill top government roles around the world are all for the citizenry getting more and more dumbed down and therefore reliant on them to survive, thereby keeping them in power. Getting rid of tests and other skills-based grading is a great way to let the educational arm of the government focus on propaganda and other such nonsense at the expense of real learning.

 

You have a valid point and yes, there are many professions that without the appropriate technical skills could not possibly undertake tasks, a doctor for example, nor would want anyone operating on me who was not duly skilled and educated in the art, a surgeon for example.

That said, I do believe the education system is geared on memory, it teaches children how to memorize things not understand and then be able to implement them in everyday life.

It should teach children that they can achieve whatever they want in life. I do not personally believe it teaches children to know what they want in life, nor that they can achieve anything if they put their minds to it.

It does not teach children about financial education, which adult, whether working or otherwise does not think of money in everyday life, yet is it at all addressed in school?

Sadly many learn this lesson in life when it is too late, debt, credit card cards, bankruptcy and the like. It should teach children how to be money savvy, a life skill in itself. It does not.

I do not believe the system teaches children how to give, how to be socially responsible, it does not educate nor prepare them for the outside world.

Sadly, believe the education system lets slip many individuals you do not fit the ‘grading system’

Intelligence should not just be on grades alone, it should also be the involvement of a lot of practicality in its approach. Let’s face it, we do not all learn the same way, what is good for one child, i.e., a test, and repeat, may not be good for another child. There should be other avenues open to children to show how talented they really are, instead of being put into a group because of one letter and categorized.

All the best.

 

Here's the problem: you can tell children that they can be anything they want and try to help them know what they would like to do. However, if they cannot read, write, do math, understand science, learn from history, etc., you are selling them an empty promise. You cannot do many things if you are functionally illiterate or not capable of handling even the most basic math tasks.

And, yes, we can give everyone a participation trophy or meaningless, puffed up grades so that they will not feel negatively labeled, but the disservice there is that they will never learn how to actually win or succeed in a very tough and cruel world. And, make no mistake, the world is extremely tough, cruel, and unfair for the vast majority of its inhabitants. And it has no sympathy, whatsoever, for its victims. Sending out poorly educated children into this world with unrealistic expectations of jobs or a lifestyle that they have not been trained for just adds to the suffering.

 

We've already been so dumbed down - it's beyond ridiculous. Just look at who they call "heroes" today. More like zeros.

 

Harvey Wolfand jrbiz are both right – however they are comparing ideal apples to ideal oranges.

• What I hope for my children is for them to be happy, fulfilled and content in their lives (and no –they don’t have to be rocket scientists).
• What I expect from my doctor, accountant or plumber, is that they be the best in their field and do not put me a risk due to lack of knowledge (should I also care that they are ethical and balanced individuals too?).

The first part of both sentences are simple, straightforward and do not contradict each other. Hence - Harvey Wolfand jrbiz are not really in a dispute.

The problematic parts are the two statements – in parentheses – that follow the initial declaration.

 

Does the average person need to know how to read, write, and perform basic mathematics to be happy, fulfilled and content in their lives, or can this average person achieve such success without such "details"? You speak about "balance" below, but the tools necessary to achieve the worthy goals you posit here do not seem to part of your equation in this bullet? Simply hoping that your children are happy, fulfilled and content in their lives and not providing an actual basis for them to achieve this is not good parenting, imo. And, btw, I am not talking about everyone becoming a rocket scientist; rather, what is really on the table these days are children being able to read, calculate prices at the grocery store, fill out a job application, etc.

And how do you get to be best in your technical field if academics are ignored and/or de-emphasized in favor of not "labeling" children with grades that make them feel bad as the other poster proposes? BTW, being ethical and balanced are good for society and are not mutually exclusive from being well-educated. However, when you are on the table under the knife, you really want the medical staff to have focused on their education and practiced skills and not worry so much if they cheat on their taxes or have interesting hobbies that make them happy.

The problematic part is not that we are discussing apples and oranges. These issues, in fact, are tightly intertwined and my position is that releasing a child into adulthood who has been dumbed down, not tested, not scored, not suffered the agony of defeat nor the joy of winning at real contests that are structured to improve their education and skills will be ill-equipped to have a fulfilling and happy life in the real world. In fact, if all that is focused on are "feel good" policies that excuse a lack of effort, discipline and hard work, the child is likely in for a less than optimal life, despite whatever hopes his or her parents may have.

 

Being passive and hoping for any outcome typically leads to failure. If you want your children to be happy, you must ACTIVELY guide them to accomplish their goals.

 

Allow me share a short story with you.

My oldest son learned English on his own – at age 5 – when he started plating adventure games on my old Commodore64.
One day, 6 years later, when he was in 5th grade, he came home with tears in his eyes. Ms. B, his English teacher had railed at him: “If you won’t pay attention in school, you will be a good for nothing and will end up being a garbage collector”. My first instinct was to have a “quiet talk” with Ms. B and give her a piece of my mind.
Over the years, Ms. B’s scolding came up occasionally at family dinners. Sometimes in anger, sometimes in jest and also as a valid defense of our municipal garbage collectors.

Some 20 years later, my son came home with a well-earned PhD in Microbiology.
He expressed a wish to go and visit Ms. B. with his credentials
I was quite worried – I was afraid that he would finally give Ms. B the dressing down she deserved.
The next day I found out that he brought Ms. B a big bouquet of flowers and told her that, at times when the going was tough, he remembered slur – and what kept him going was his desire to prove her wrong.​

As I mentioned in my first post on this subject: It is the teacher’s duty to teach and impart knowledge and the parent’s obligation to be supportive.

 

@sarahk and @shalom_m are making my case for me by showing just how nasty and cruel the world can be with their examples. It is a given that teachers, doctors, pharmacists, etc., are humans and have human failings and biases. There are countless horror stories of teachers saying and doing stupid things that parents and/or students are upset by, sometimes for a lifetime. It is the same with most any profession. Most people are honest and ethical (I believe) but there are an awful lot of people in all walks of life that are not. Some are downright evil, in fact. As I mentioned previously, this is a very cruel, unfair, and unfeeling world and that is the basis of my lamenting about children being ill-educated and, therefore, totally unprepared to compete in the environment that we all live in.

The trouble comes when the *policy* of an educational system is not to educate and prepare its children for this reality but to make students feel good in their ignorance by giving out inflated grades or eliminating them entirely, not testing, lowering academic standards, etc. They will not feel so good about themselves when they are faced with the vicious world awaiting them in adulthood and discover that their "education" has failed them miserably.

I see this playing out every day in my job. It has become a cliché about Millennials who have grown up getting participation trophies, never learning how to write or do math very well, and worse. They come into a job and do not understand being held accountable and having to do good work and actually produce results. They expect to be rewarded for showing up (most of the time) and just "being themselves." They come to any competition unarmed and, make no mistake, competition is fierce in the real world.

 

90% of the Americans think that they will live on mars in old age. so its true burgers are vegetables.

 

There is not enough nutrition in a Mars bar to sustain life assuming that Mars does not go bankrupt by the time said people reach old age.