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The World Is Flat by Thomas Friedman

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by oalhajjar, Jul 6, 2005.

  1. #1
    I'm in the middle of reading this book and I was wondering if anyone has read it?

    http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0374292884/

    It's such a powerful book about globalization, technology, and how the world is being flatened. Political barriers are being demolished and trade barriers are being reduced and it's making for a more cohesive and connected world.

    I know many of the techies on this board would love the parts about outsourcing to india, Google as a filter of the world's knowledge, the dot-com bubble, and more.

    Thomas is a technology optimist, a globalization supportor, and one hell of a writer. If you read one book this summer, make sure it's this one!

    Your thoughts about the book?
     
    oalhajjar, Jul 6, 2005 IP
  2. ServerUnion

    ServerUnion Peon

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    #2
    My car radio broke and stuck on liberal talk radio, needless to say I hate "the man" and its' increasing role in trying to mold an international social climate without any consideration of the effects.

    We have 2 choices no: 1) Be in the top 1/10th percent 2) Become more poor every year
     
    ServerUnion, Jul 6, 2005 IP
  3. adam_stewart

    adam_stewart Banned

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    #3
    you guys make me want to check out the book!
     
    adam_stewart, Jul 6, 2005 IP
  4. mhdoc

    mhdoc Tauren

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    #4
    I found it really interesting. I have thought for some time the terms "Republican" and "Democrat" no longer describe people in a useful way. He has some interesting thoughts on that.

    It was interesting to read his discription of the graphics design company and realize I am attempting to be one of the people messing up their business model. (No real artistic talent, but with tools like photoshop as a crutch, maybe even I can make something beautiful :)

    I had no idea of the level of global integration a company Dell has created.

    I thought there was lots of food for thought.
     
    mhdoc, Jul 6, 2005 IP
  5. noppid

    noppid gunnin' for the quota

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    #5
    Yep globolization is good until you realize you stopped supporting the local ecomony and there is no longer a "your neighborhood" because no tax was collected from commerce locally to have a locally and there are no customers because you sent the work elsewhere and no one made a pay check to buy your product. :/
     
    noppid, Jul 6, 2005 IP
  6. dvduval

    dvduval Notable Member

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    #6
    I read the whole book at a Barnes and Noble over coffee one day...
    Great book if you are into future thinking. :)
     
    dvduval, Jul 6, 2005 IP
  7. chris45

    chris45 Peon

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    #7
    I've heard good things about that one.
     
    chris45, Jul 7, 2005 IP
  8. sadcox66

    sadcox66 Spirit Walker

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    #8
    Interesting take.
    For the last 50+ years the USA has been hammering other countries to open up and accept globalization and competition with their local industries and now that the local industries have done that the USA wants to build an iron curtain and protect it's local industries rather than competing globally like they have preached

    I am guessing this only applies when it hits close to home ;)
     
    sadcox66, Jul 7, 2005 IP
  9. sadcox66

    sadcox66 Spirit Walker

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    #9
    I did not read the book but watched/listened to three of his interviews.
    He is a good writer-speaker but skips around the facts-numbers and makes connections that incite and provoke listeners-readers.

    Stuff related to Jobs/Outsourcing

    Some numbers you should know - grabbed from wired.com
    1.) India made USD 5Billion income in 2003 from outsourcing.
    USA spends more than this on hurricane damage in Florida alone every year.
    2.) More jobs are lost due to automation than outsourcing - discussed at
    slashdot last week.
    3.) Job losses due to mis-management (Enron, Worldcom, Tyco, GM, HP, IBM ... etc ) a lot more than jobs lost due to outsourcing to other countries... no IBM and HP have a bad business model
    4.) Depression and job losses in 1991 in the USA (when outsourcing did not exist).... due to automation.
    In fact automation has reduced the number of
    bank tellers with ATM
    security guards with cameras
    bank employees , mall employees with cash register at the door
    factory workers with automated machines (wave solder, welders, painters)
    programmers with open-source and 3GL, 4GL languages
    farm workers with automation (dairy, fertilizing, seeding, watering - need people to pick tomatoes however)

    The reality is your neighbourhood shops/services are no longer as valuable because you can get stuff cheaper(or better quality) from further away due to improvements and low price of transportation (planes,trains, trucks) and telecommunication (internet, fax).

    There is a lot more that has happened in the last 20 years and outsourcing and globalization is only a small fraction of what has happened. It's just that it did not affect the educated white collars in developed nations till now... but we knew it was coming ... right ?

    Near future prediction of job losses

    I hope future books and articles will focus on how we will can remain gainfully employed rather than
    pretending outsourcing and job losses are directly related. The link above gives you a 50 year trend.
     
    sadcox66, Jul 7, 2005 IP
  10. earlpearl

    earlpearl Well-Known Member

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    #10
    Haven't read the book but try and read his editorials. He is published a couple of times a week in the New York Times and is syndicated in other newspapers around the US. Excellent writer/thinker. I don't think he can be totally pigeonholed as a traditional liberal. His perspectives cover a lot of territory.

    Dave
     
    earlpearl, Jul 7, 2005 IP
  11. digimania

    digimania Peon

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    #11
    The review mentioned something about Globalization 3.0...I didn't even realize there was Globalization 2.0 or Globalization 1.0.
     
    digimania, Jul 7, 2005 IP
  12. sadcox66

    sadcox66 Spirit Walker

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    #12
    Roughly from his interview
    1.0: Popularity of Railroad, steam boats, ships
    2.0: Airplane after WWII and telepones
    3.0: Internet

    4.0: DigitalPoint takes over the world
     
    sadcox66, Jul 7, 2005 IP
  13. oalhajjar

    oalhajjar Guest

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    #13
    Gloablization:

    1.0 - Nations Globalized (countries started trading with each others, immigration, etc)
    2.0 - Corporates Globalized (multinational corps)
    3.0 - Individuals Globalize (Individuals are now competiting and collaborating with other individuals all over the world)

    The playing field is being leveled he says.
     
    oalhajjar, Jul 7, 2005 IP
  14. ServerUnion

    ServerUnion Peon

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    #14
    I read some great publications pushing the theory that there should really not by much job loss from economic shifts such as globalization, just shifts of the workforce to new skill sets. If only the world was fair like that.

    Shifts is skillsets? So if for some reason I cannot work in IT anymore, the theory states that there will always be a job if you are willing to increase skillsets or change geographical location. In other words, move or work as a fry cook at mcdonalds. I for one rather sell my blood and get drunk with the money! This is the reason this theory doesn't apply but in a general manner.
     
    ServerUnion, Jul 7, 2005 IP
  15. ferret77

    ferret77 Heretic

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    #15
    When I graduated from college there was no way to find a full time IT job

    I cursed outsourcing etc

    But I learn to hustle stuff on the internet, now I outsource most of the web work I get.

    I have designer in Poland, link builders in india , and a programmer in ... NY. (Because I would rather pay more for programming that 100% works)

    I think outsorucing will end up hurting more people in the US then it helps, but that is usually the case isn't it.

    On guru there are thousands of small business offshoring all the work they can. I'm not sure what the future will bring. Either our dollar will fall enough so its just as cheap to get work here. Or what?
     
    ferret77, Jul 7, 2005 IP
  16. Jimdigi

    Jimdigi Peon

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    #16
    Looks like another book will take a part of my budget...
     
    Jimdigi, Jul 7, 2005 IP
  17. sadcox66

    sadcox66 Spirit Walker

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    #17

    Question: Guess who wants you to focus on outsourcing ?
    Answer: The people who are stealing your money elsewhere.


    Read the articles I pointed to in an earlier post.


    Here are some more articles.
    Myths and Realities: The False Crisis of Outsourcing
    http://www.heritage.org/Research/Economy/bg1757.cfm

    Look at the predictions here
    india...market is projected to be worth 44 billion dollars by 2010.
    http://www.banknetindia.com/banking/1015.htm
    Now 44 billion dollars in year 2010 is what India will earn.



    USA is spending 250 Billion (NOW !) in iraq alone !!



    Outsourcing is a drop in a huge bucket...
    compare the numbers in any decent economic journal

    The primary reason why life style in the usa is declining is
    a.) Excessive Expenditure by politicians favouring their cronies
    b.) High profile scamming by companies and CEO that pay no taxes
    c.) Automation which was expected all along

    To change the tide and make our life better we need to concentrate on the big chunks of expenditure above.

    India ungently needing to recruit up to 120,000 foreigners
    http://www.zdnetindia.com/news/national/stories/122965.html
     
    sadcox66, Jul 8, 2005 IP