@Vegetarians

>>beans are living things too, aren't they?

yes, they are.

There is a difference between the life of a 1000 yrs old tree vs a grass's life.
There is a difference between an animal life vs a plant life.
There is a difference between an elephant life vs an ant life.
There is a difference between a human life vs an animal life.


http://www.sentientbeings.org/notables.htm

 

Well in general vegetarians are usually lacto-ovo vegetarians who don't eat meat, but consume dairy (eggs, cheese, milk). And in general they will wear leather, maybe fur, suede, silk, wool, etc.. There are definitely vegetarians that avoid some of those and not others, as it all depends on their feelings about it.

Vegans, or sometimes called total vegetarians will avoid all animal derived products, and animal tested products. In general they will do their best to not wear, consume, or otherwise contribute to the use/exploitation of animals what so ever.

As far as the protein is concerned vegans/vegetarians in general get plenty of protein, and this is only a myth that they lack this vital nutrient in their diets. Here are more vegan myths.

Hope this helps.

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I wanted to add this Google search result page of "vegans get plenty" just because of the good info and funny shirts the good people over at vegan porn have made. (no it's not actual porn)

 

>>but consume dairy (eggs, cheese, milk).

dairy are vegetarian food
eggs are not vegetarian food

do not mix up

 

to you, not to everyone. i know eggs are not a vegan food - but i know a lot of vegetarians who eat eggs. you can say they are not true vegetarians, and they would disagree with you.

 

i know a lot of ( not strict ) vegetarians who eat eggs.

how about fish eggs ?

if you accept vegetarian can eat eggs,
many people claim they eat vegetarian but eat pork, oysters, fishes too.

 

Some powerful mythology surrounds our politics of protein... we actually need far less than most people assume... I use the word politics because protein supply and demand are inextricably linked to power relationships within cultures that derive from hunter gatherer, IMO.

 

Eggs is a different story then pork. Pork is meat, eggs aren't. Sure, they have the potential to one day become meat, but they currently aren't. can't say the same about fish and pork.

 

It all depends on who you ask.

You can get real specific and say that the definition of vegetarian is one who does not consume animals or animal derived foods. I would think eggs and dairy are included in an animal derived product.

There is the term Ovo-Lacto Vegetarian that can describe the consumption of eggs and dairy within a vegetarian diet.

Or Lacto Vegetarian - that eats no meat or eggs, but will consume milk/dairy.

Then of course there are the vegans that don't mess around.

 

Vegans smell funny.

 

That vegan porn site is funny, it is actually a pretty impressive organization, and ranks around #7 for the term "porn". I found this, uhh, doing some....research... yes. I actually did, but no one will believe me .

 

you did a better job of explaining what i meant then i did

 

I agree with this as well. We are told to consume more protein then the human body actually needs.

We are also told that Omega 3 fatty acids are essential and only found in fish, hence you need to eat/buy fish. But Omega-3s are found in abundance in flax seed, and hemp seed. And they are readily available at health food stores, if not the "regular" grocery stores as well. (I don't go to the "regulars" very often if at all.)

A similar story with vitamin D. I've read stories that say veg*ans are defficient in this vitamin and they add that to another reason not to be a veg*an. But your body can create this vitamin D on its own with skin exposure to the sun. Just go outside and catch some rays, and you are done.

I've also heard these types of stories with calcium, and the need for cholesterol.
The funny thing about cholesterol is that it is only found in animal derived foods. And the human body creates enough of the good cholesterol to satisfy our needs. Thus on the true vegan diet cholesterol intake is zero and in general you never have to worry about a low or high cholesterol level.

 

I beg to differ.

[Beware vegan talk] Without all the rotting carcas in your body I would think you'd smell and taste better. [/end] And I've read some threads on that vegan porn site to back that up. (here is a quick littel post that relates to that.)

Of course there is always general personal hygine as well. To bad veganism doesn't include a mandatory shower every day.

 

Back on the protein: I mention protein because of the obvious sign that many vegitarians have when they don't get enough protein in their diets: dark, sunken eyes. I have vegetarian friends whose health have greatly (GREATLY) improved by adding glyconutrients in their diets and they no longer have the dark eyes. Part of getting enough protein is whether or not your body is obsorbing the protiens or not. Not necessary just eating enough.

I am definitely not against the vegatarian diet, just seen too many think it was the best but were sickly because they didn't know how to balance that diet.

 

And not knowing how to balance the diet is the key there. I think we both agree on that.

On the Standard American Diet (SAD) I would venture to say that most people get sick because they don't know how to balance their diet. It's semi-difficult either way, herbivore or omnivorous. As the food that is most conveniently avaiable and get the most advertising for is food that doesn't satisfy a "balanced diet."
And I say semi-difficult because I feel veganism is extremely easy for me, now that I'm 5+ years into it, it's just that you need to know what to get, and where you can get it. Plus what to do with it when you get it to make it tasty and not overconsume.

There should be a class on food and nutrition for students. It would be a very valuable tool.

About those glyconutrients: I've read breifly on them and saw that there are natural sources of these found in mushrooms, seeds, fruits and vegetables. I've always kind of figured I get enough by eating a good variety of these foods on a weekly basis.
This thread has sparked my interest in them again and I will read up a little more to make more sense of them. Thanks.

 

Yes there are foods with the glyconutrients in them, just hard to find. There are 8 essential sugars and most people get 2 in their diets. Human breast milk has them and that is why it is so important to not go to formula for a baby! It plays a major role in your immune system.

Look up glycobiology for more info. For me, I supplement with glyconutrients and within 2 weeks my asthma was gone, within a year my color-blindness has improved, my overall health has improved, my family hardly gets sick and if we do we get well fast. I am totally sold on them.

 

Vegans also look funny, with those long skinny grey arms and big eyes

That's a bit of a straw man, isn't it? I don't know who would have told you that Omega 3 EFAs are only found in fish -- I can't say I've ever heard anyone make that claim. Omega 3 EFAs are found in whole grains (not only flax seed and hemp) and also in certain vegetables.

It is true that some fish are excellent sources for this nutrient, though. Back in the old days they used to give kids cod liver oil - that was before anyone knew what Omega 3 was, but it turns out there was method in that (rather disgusting) madness...

 

What do you call an OLD vegetarian who drinks milk, then?

A lacto-octo-vegenarian?

 

I don't think I hear this much if at all anymore, but I remember more than one person telling me this in person. Of course they weren't the best informed, but it was what they "heard/read."

And I would say that most websites that mentions Omega-3 EFAs will list off more types of fish than grains, seeds, or veggies.

 

>>Ovo-Lacto Vegetarian that can describe the consumption of eggs and dairy within a vegetarian diet.
>>Or Lacto Vegetarian - that eats no meat or eggs, but will consume milk/dairy.


True, there are such terms for not so strict vegetarians
(or better called not yet true vegetarian )

vegetarian = no meat no fishes no eggs
vegan = no food come from animal source

>> they have the potential to one day become meat

enough, the life form is there,
you cannot get a chick out of a potato.

>> but i know a lot of vegetarians who eat eggs. you can say they are not true vegetarians, and they would disagree with you.

i know a lot of vegetarians who strictly not eat any egg. you can say they are going too far, and they would disagree with you too.

Egg and fish are non-vegetarian
http://www.jainpushp.org/veggie.htm